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I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15735] Tue, 31 May 2011 04:59 Go to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
Messages: 10
Registered: May 2011
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Hello,

I'm looking for a very good distortion pedal with a good flavor for my Cascade K100-2 head with 2x12 Original Jensen C12N. i tried my TRex Alberta (TS like) and i'm not convinced.
Does anyone tried a vintage Proco Rat into a K100-2 or K100 head with Jensen speaker ?

Thanks a lot for your support
Jeremie from Paris
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15737 is a reply to message #15735] Tue, 31 May 2011 13:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kustom_Bart is currently offline  Kustom_Bart
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Registered: October 2010
Location: Greenville, MichiGUN
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The Pro Co rat is a great pedal, but do yourself a favor and get at least a Boss ME-50 or similar multi effect unit pedal. These things really make the amps sound great and you have delay, distortion, chorus, etc. all in one unit. You can go the multiple pedal way, but for the money the multi effect unit is hands down the best deal for the money. Just my .02 Smile
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15738 is a reply to message #15735] Tue, 31 May 2011 13:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
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I have all the effects that I need. I want only a dirt pedal warm and which sound good with type of SS amp. Did you try the proco with vintage kustoms?
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15741 is a reply to message #15738] Tue, 31 May 2011 21:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
cassent5150 is currently offline  cassent5150
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Call me old school, but I have alot of guys at gigs asking similar questions and all I use is an old Made in Japan Boss SD-1. Yes it has the JRC 4558 chip just like some tube screamers. It has a warmer sound than any distortion petal I've ever had the pleasure of trying. We got caught in the rain on an outside gig and my pedal got wet and quit on me. I went to no ends trying to get that sound back. I found 2 more on ebay and paid the money to replace it with another made in Japan Boss SD-1 These were made at the Roland Plant while it was in Japan before it moved Taiwan. My set up is Strat into a Boss SD-1 into a Digitech RP-50 Channel 5 factory setting then strait in to any plexi face Kustom. When I show up for a jam I watch everyone reaching to there amps and turning knobs trying to get that awesome tone. I just posted some pictures a couple days ago of the band (SCR) on the comment board you may be able to see the set up at my feet. I'm the one singing playing that lipstick red strat. My theory on my sound is get your distortion then EQ it how you like it then go to the amp with it. It works for me!!! Steve C

Steve C
icon14.gif  Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15743 is a reply to message #15735] Wed, 01 June 2011 04:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
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Registered: May 2011
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Thanks a lot for your reply and your experience , I will check that
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15745 is a reply to message #15743] Wed, 01 June 2011 11:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zedsalt is currently offline  zedsalt
Messages: 63
Registered: March 2008
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I've never been a fan of the Rat's scooped mids. I'd go for some sort of germanium fuzz, maybe a fuzz then a real tube preamp stompbox for real sonic mayhem.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15746 is a reply to message #15735] Wed, 01 June 2011 11:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
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Sorry but a germanium fuzz into a clean amp is just awful Sad
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15751 is a reply to message #15745] Wed, 01 June 2011 13:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
centipedefarmer is currently offline  centipedefarmer
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Location: Des Moines, IA
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Slightly OT but I find Rat II with the tone knob all the way to the right, on a bass through my Kustom K200-A1 2x15 bass to be awesome.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15752 is a reply to message #15735] Wed, 01 June 2011 14:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
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Thanks Wink I will try the rat and the vintage SD1
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15758 is a reply to message #15752] Thu, 02 June 2011 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zedsalt is currently offline  zedsalt
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I'm reminded of all of the "he came in with a truckload of amps, and the only amp that ended up on the album was the tape machine's" stories I've heard/read from engineers through the years, including more than a few that corresponded to some of the biggest names in Rock, telling an interviewer about some combination of exotic and/or expensive amps that was responsible for a magic tone they achieved on what became a classic song.
And I've long since lost count of the number of times someone has refused to be believe that some tone I've crafted didn't involve an amp. When it appears hopeless, I usually say something like, "OK, you got me; it was a ___________ (insert name of some obscure, cheap, old amp here)" or "If an amp has an input for harmonica, check it out; if it's labeled 'harp', buy it" (actually there's more than a grain of truth in that one).
The point is, uniquely ear-pleasing tones will always be of value, especially as long as there are people who believe there are rules to this sort of thing.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15759 is a reply to message #15758] Thu, 02 June 2011 10:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zedsalt is currently offline  zedsalt
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And centipedefarmer makes a good point- like distortion itself, most great tones are the result of doing something "wrong".
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15760 is a reply to message #15758] Thu, 02 June 2011 10:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
centipedefarmer is currently offline  centipedefarmer
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Well, as for the former, I can imagine people bringing the same setup to the studio that they use live and finding that while it works great live, it doesn't translate recorded. Doesn't mean the guy was dumb for thinking he needed all those amps, just means that the show and the studio are different situations. In fact, I was just reading an interview in Tape Op in which such a story was related, and the guy telling it was both the guitarist and engineer in the story.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15761 is a reply to message #15759] Thu, 02 June 2011 10:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
centipedefarmer is currently offline  centipedefarmer
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Might be worth pointing out that I'm using this on bass, and the Rat II isn't considered a bass distortion. It's one of the very few with which I don't lose too much low end for my liking, but having the filter knob all the way "up" helps (the Rat's filter knob runs a bit counterintuitive to how you think of a "tone" knob). I've been asked more than once during tear down how I was getting that distortion tone. And, it always helps to have a great clean tone to start with, for which I credit my Kustom and my P-Bass. Smile

Oh, it also doesn't sound at all the same when I get one of those sound guys that wants to run me direct from in front of my amp. Distortion on bass run direct, to my experience, always sound like crap. I tell them just mic the thing.

[Updated on: Thu, 02 June 2011 11:01]

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Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15763 is a reply to message #15746] Thu, 02 June 2011 15:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pleat is currently offline  pleat
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I guess it depends on what sound your looking for. The early fuzz pedals that used germanium transistors for the fuzz effect depended on what style of guitar was being used. I ran a 1965 Dallas Arbitor fuzz face, and found that to get the best sound was humbucking pickups and the guitar volume wide open. Turning down the guitars volume would make the fuzz effect drop off fast and did give a less than pleasing sound. I got around that by using a volume pedal after the fuzz tone.
Running a Tele the sound it thinner and if you roll back the volume, it really gets nasty sounding.
I used kustom amps back then and still do today. The modern distortion pedals aren't the same as the fuzz pedals so each has it's place for the style of music your playing.
pleat
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15773 is a reply to message #15763] Fri, 03 June 2011 11:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
zedsalt is currently offline  zedsalt
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I probably should clarify- I wasn't poking fun at anyone for being a gearhead (way too much of a "glass house" situation), I was getting a laugh out of the obstinacy that even the most revered among us display when faced with some engineer trying to get us out of our habits by doing something like taking a link out of our signal chains and/or getting us to use a piece of gear that's not among our faves. I mean, like Jimmy Page talking for decades about the custom mods on the Marshall he recorded "Dazed and Confused" with vs. decades of Glyn Johns saying that the studio version was strictly a Tele through a Tone Bender into a tiny, close-mic'ed Silvertone amp (or was it a Burns? a Baldwin, maybe? something tiny and cheap and nasty, like so many of the great "Arena Rock" classics were recorded with)...c'mon, that's at least good for a chuckle.
Djims, probably the best piece of advice anyone can give you is to not be afraid to return something that just doesn't give you the sound you like. Unless you have a friend who runs a brick-and-mortar music store who wouldn't mind you dragging your amp in to check out a bunch of pedals, that's your best bet. You know one thing you don't want is a Tube Screamer clone (probably...I mean, there's a pretty wide range of tones among all the clones). So, maybe a Big Muff...or a repro of an old DOD...or the aforementioned Germanium fuzz...or a silicon fuzz...or chaining a couplefew amps together...or taking the preamp out of a reel-to-reel recorder...if nothing else, it's an awful lot of fun to try stuff out.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15779 is a reply to message #15773] Fri, 03 June 2011 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
centipedefarmer is currently offline  centipedefarmer
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There's different Big Muffs too, and their sound varies... you've got the Electro-Harmonix silver-and-red ones, and the black ones, all pretty decent, but then you've got the army-green Sovtek ones, which are kickass if you can still find one. Have that Weezer Blue Album sound, great with just about anything.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15783 is a reply to message #15735] Sat, 04 June 2011 12:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
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Thanks a lot all for your interest Wink
I already tried germanium fuzz, germanium treble boost and the ts clone. I always thought with all my amps that a fuzz is awesome with little cranked amp or already overdrived amps but not with a clean amp, too much ice pick treble for me but it's a matter of taste !!!!
I will try the Rat on Monday, I will post a review !!!
Thanks
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15785 is a reply to message #15735] Sat, 04 June 2011 18:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pleat is currently offline  pleat
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The K100-2 reverb head has only one channel. BRIGHT to say the least. If you ever get a chance to try out a K100-1 two channel head and use the normal channel you will be amazed at how well it sounds compared to your amp. I have owned several of both model 1 and model 2 heads. The model 1 head is by far the best for fat full tone. Since I use a processor pedal for all my effects, I use the normal channel even on the K200 heads.
pleat
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15796 is a reply to message #15735] Sun, 05 June 2011 15:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Djims is currently offline  Djims
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hi, i don't think that the K100-2 is really bright, for me it's very fender like, really 3D for me Wink and is one of the best clean have ever heard ! the reverb is awesome, really a great amp for me and what's a cool design !!! but it's very subjective as usual
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15803 is a reply to message #15796] Mon, 06 June 2011 09:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
C4ster
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I have K100-1's and K100-2's and the -1 is brighter than the -2's normal side. But, the speakers are the biggest determining factor. I love the sound of the CTS 12's for guitar. They were sold as a bass cabinet. I also have 2 K100-2's with JBL E140's and that works well for guitar also. Again, a bass speaker. I need to find a good pedal for my style also. I have a Digitech Rp200 that I hate. I am ready to back to simple analog pedals or build a tube distortion box. But most fuzz type pedals create tons of higher order harmonics that a Kustom will turn into ear piercing sounds that I don't find pleasing. I had an Ibanez Tube Screamer from the 80's that has mysteriously disappeared. I am seriously considering buying a vintage TS because I did like that one with a Kustom K200. I suspect that one I will be happy with.
Conrad
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #15806 is a reply to message #15803] Mon, 06 June 2011 12:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
cassent5150 is currently offline  cassent5150
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I suggest that you give a early (Made in Japan) BOSS SD-1 a try. Take your head to a guitar center and hook to a cab and try some petals out. I think you may find what your looking for a whole lot easier this way. The Boss SD-1 they make today still isnt all that bad sounding (through my K200's), they seem to stay warm sounding even through the solid state of Kustoms.

Steve C
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18805 is a reply to message #15806] Fri, 31 May 2013 04:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bozole is currently offline  bozole
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Registered: May 2013
Location: Paris (France)
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Hi

Just to let you know what to do for modding K100-2 amps (convert the treble boost channel to the K100-1 normal channel, keeping the reverb and tremolo features) :

You just have to remove from the board 4 components : R127, C116, C117, C118 (you'll find a picture from the portion of the schematic here : http://vintageamps.free.fr/K100-2mod.jpg

Another mod interesting if you want to have a reverb with a much less pronounced intensity : increase the size of R170. For me, 120K works fine, try different values to find the best one for you Wink

[Updated on: Sat, 01 June 2013 03:13]

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Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18806 is a reply to message #18805] Fri, 31 May 2013 06:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pleat is currently offline  pleat
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Very cool post. Not being a tech. When removing the 4 parts, do you place a jumper wire in it's place to complete the circuit, or just remove the parts?

pleat
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18807 is a reply to message #15735] Fri, 31 May 2013 13:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
chicagobill
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Registered: April 2003
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I haven't had a chance to completely figure out what this mod does yet, but two of the caps that he is removing will actually increase the treble response of the amp. C116 and C118 are there to eliminate high frequencies, like radio signals and oscillations. Removing them will not help tame the high end of the amp.

Removing R127 is the only thing that I see will let less high frequency enter the circuit. And don't replace it with a jumper or you will have the exact opposite effect.

That entire circuit is exactly the same as the circuit in the model K100-1 bright channel.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18808 is a reply to message #18807] Fri, 31 May 2013 15:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pleat is currently offline  pleat
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I think what he is trying to do, is to convert the bright channel of the K100-2 to match the normal channel of the K100-1 amp. So what your saying is the bright channel in both amps use the same circuit. I found it odd that the reverb would ever have to be increased, every one I've ever owned has way too much reverb.
pleat
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18809 is a reply to message #18807] Fri, 31 May 2013 15:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pleat is currently offline  pleat
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I think what he is trying to do, is to convert the bright channel of the K100-2 to match the normal channel of the K100-1 amp. So what your saying is the bright channel in both amps use the same circuit. I found it odd that the reverb would ever have to be increased, every one I've ever owned has way too much reverb.
pleat
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18810 is a reply to message #15735] Fri, 31 May 2013 16:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
chicagobill
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Just the opposite for the reverb, he said "if you want to have a reverb with a much less pronounced intensity ", you increase the value of the mixing resistor.

And yes, with the exception of the added effects circuits the bright channels of both versions of the K100 share the same electronic design.
Re: I'm looking for a suitable distortion pedal for My K100-2 [message #18812 is a reply to message #18806] Sat, 01 June 2013 03:11 Go to previous message
bozole is currently offline  bozole
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Hi

pleat wrote on Fri, 31 May 2013 12:46
Very cool post. Not being a tech. When removing the 4 parts, do you place a jumper wire in it's place to complete the circuit, or just remove the parts?

pleat

You just need to remove the parts, no jumpers at all

chicagobill wrote on Fri, 31 May 2013 19:36
I haven't had a chance to completely figure out what this mod does yet, but two of the caps that he is removing will actually increase the treble response of the amp. C116 and C118 are there to eliminate high frequencies, like radio signals and oscillations. Removing them will not help tame the high end of the amp.

Removing R127 is the only thing that I see will let less high frequency enter the circuit. And don't replace it with a jumper or you will have the exact opposite effect.

For me, just removing R127 is not enough to calm really the treble boost implemented in this amp ... I tried this at first, and it definitely wasn't enough
I'm definitly not a transistor specialist, I exclusively work on tube amps, but this time I made an exception to mod this amp for a friend, and I can assure you that removing this 4 parts (3 caps and 1 resistor) made the amp way more usable with a guitar : no more treble boost.
The purpose was to convert the K100-2 channel (just one channel in this amp, and it has the treble boost circuit as the bright channel from the K100-1) to the K100-1 normal channel (keeping the reverb effect), making it way more usable with guitars, and that's exactly what this mod does ...

For R170, we finally choose 120K (I edited my original post with this new value), because with 270K, you loose the possibility to go in "surf" territory with the reverb ...
We finally selected by ears 120K which is really fine (the reverb is in my point of view way too pronounced in the stock circuit ...)

[Updated on: Sat, 01 June 2013 03:12]

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