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Ohms [message #18858]

Wed, 12 June 2013 10:18

Gavindale
Messages: 14
Registered: January 2010

Junior Member

Hello all. I own a K-200-4-A. On the back is a single 1/4" output for the speaker cable. What OHM rating is this amp looking for?
I have a 3-15" JBL D-131-F cab. I believe it is rated at 3.67 +/- ohms. Am I correct?
(This is the cab I have had connected to the K-200)
I have 2 cabs with 2-15" speakers and one horn. What are they rated? (ohms & watts)
I have one 4-12" speaker cab. What is it rated for? (ohms & watts)

I also have a Kasino Concert. It is clearly marked with 2 outputs 8 ohms for each. Does this amp have to see both inputs connected to 8 ohm cabs to meet its output safety level? Or can I hook up just one 8 ohm cab?

The Kasino spent its life (so the story goes) feeding the 2 2-15" speaker and one horn cabs I described above.

Thank you all for any help you can provide. Razz

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Re: Ohms [message #18859 is a reply to message #18858]

Wed, 12 June 2013 10:38

pleat
Messages: 1452
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

The K200A-4 head should have two speaker output jacks on the back panel. One may have been removed for some reason? The K200 head will deliver 100 watts RMS into a total of 4 ohms. It will run any impedance higher than 4 ohms safely.

Not knowing what your 3x15 D130F cab really has in for speakers. It's hard to tell after 45 + years, if someone may have switched brands or impedance of one or more speakers. If still stock the speakers will be 16 ohms each wired in parallel for 5.6 ohm total cab impedance.

Assuming your 3x15 horn cabs are the siren 3x15 cabs, and not tampered with over the years, same impedance of 5.6 ohms each. You can hook up the two horn cabs to the Concert Head without damage.

pleat

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Re: Ohms [message #18861 is a reply to message #18858]

Wed, 12 June 2013 12:16

chicagobill
Messages: 2005
Registered: April 2003

Senior Member

Pleat, the 2X15+siren cabs will not be the same as a 3X15 cab impedance wise. The siren or horns are blocked with the crossover cap so they only show the impedance of the two 15s, so 8 ohms.

All of the original 4X12 square cabs that I have seen were wired with four 16 ohm speaker in parallel for a total load of 4 ohms.

The vertical PA cabs were wired differently. Which type of cab do you have?

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Re: Ohms [message #18862 is a reply to message #18858]

Wed, 12 June 2013 12:28

Gavindale
Messages: 14
Registered: January 2010

Junior Member

Ahh yes. Hiding behind the power cord was the #2 output.

The 3-15" JBL cab had 3 blown speakers when I bought it. I had them reconed using JBL parts and rewired it myself. I was off on the numbers because it was over a year ago and I forgot what it worked out to. Yes they are all 16 ohm speakers. If I remember correctly there was a crossover cap in this cab. Or not. Damn I hate to pull the 196 screws to open the backs of these but if I must, I must.

The siren cabs I have never opened or even hooked up to the Kasino.

The 4-12" is a PA vertical cab. Sorry for not mentioning that before.

So is it OK to just plug in the one 3-15" cab to the K-200 head? I have to admit it. I have done it. WOW! Shocked

I could not believe it. Great tone AND Decibels.

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Re: Ohms [message #18863 is a reply to message #18862]

Wed, 12 June 2013 14:07

Kustom_Bart
Messages: 601
Registered: October 2010
Location: Greenville, MichiGUN

Senior Member

Simply plug a 1/4" cable into it and take an ohm meter and touch the tip and sleeve of the other end of the cable and it will give you close to the ohm rating.

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Re: Ohms [message #18865 is a reply to message #18863]

Wed, 12 June 2013 16:50

pleat
Messages: 1452
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

The siren 3x15 cab is 5.3 ohm total load. The crossover cap may block a reading with a simple ohm meter but according to my dealer wiring chart the 3x15 siren cab is listed as 5.3 ohm.

On the reconed 3x15 JBL cab, if you wired the three 16 ohm speakers in parallel you you have 5.3 ohms and is safe to run the K200A-4 head. If the 3x15 cab originally had the crossover cap, and you wired it to the top speaker, it won't hurt anything, but the top speaker will try and act like a Mid horn, not as much bass response. If all the speakers sound the same, then you probably didn't wire the cap in the circuit and save you the time from removing the back.

You mentioned you have a Kasino Concert PA head, does it have the matching cabs? What brand is the vertical 4x12 cab?
pleat

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Re: Ohms [message #18870 is a reply to message #18858]

Thu, 13 June 2013 13:07

Gavindale
Messages: 14
Registered: January 2010

Junior Member

Great information! Thank you.

I must have opened up one of the horn cabs at some point and remember seeing the crossover in there. My regular 3-15" is straight.

The 4-12" vertical is a Kustom in gold sparkle. It was a weird deal where an old guy owned it as part of a set but one cab got ripped off at a gig so he just sold me the one he had. CTS speakers.

The Kasino is also a weird one. It was claimed that the amp and the 2 cabs were purchased as a set. BUT one cab is missing the Kustom badge ( no damage or ANY evidence of ever having one, original grill cloth in great condition) and they are different sizes. One is 22 1/2" wide and the other is 24 1/2". Both are in Gold sparkle (yes I checked the color under a tuck) Purchased new by a church from the store I got it from. Who knows about that. My K-200 is missing the reverb pan so I am hoping that the one from the Kasino will fit it. Will it?

Another Kustom Mystery........whooooooo....ghost sound

AND a few days ago one of my students, I own a guitar school, brought in a Kasino by Kustom guitar. Two single coil pickups made by Gifmen with no selector. Tone knob and volume knob. Vibrato tailpiece. Horrible plywood body with original finish (sunburst) and black pickguard and backplate. The neck has open gear 6 on a side on one plate tuners. The wood looks like maple but the fretboard has NO finish whastsoever on it. Filthy with dirt but there to stay. The back of the neck has me confused as it "almost" looks like it had a finish on it but I can not tell for sure. Terrible plastic nut and open trussrod cavity on the face.

I plugged the guitar into a very nice amp and it KILLED. It sounded better then my two strats. He paid $10 at a garage sale. Laughing

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Re: Ohms [message #18871 is a reply to message #18870]

Thu, 13 June 2013 14:49

pleat
Messages: 1452
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

One thing I don't think you mentioned. When you had the JBL's reconed, were they done as 16 ohms or 8 ohms each? If they were done with 8 ohm cones, and wired in parallel, you have 2.66 ohms which will make the amp run hot and may do some damage. The K200's want a max of 4 ohms total load.

On the two Gold siren 3x15 cabinets, you have a Frankie 3x15 cab and an K200 series cab. The Frankie cabs, if you count the number of Tuck & Rolls across the top, the Frankie is 11 T&R. The newer K200 series cab is 12 T&R which explains the difference in the width of the cabs. The Frankie cab that has never had any evidence of a name badge would place it 65-66 era. There may or may not have the four 3" port holes behind the grill cloth. Without the port holes, would place it in the very early times of Kustom.

The Kasino guitar is probably a newer off shore import.

pleat

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Re: Ohms [message #21497 is a reply to message #18871]

Mon, 22 September 2014 18:34

Gavindale
Messages: 14
Registered: January 2010

Junior Member

Hey Pleat, I know it has been a long time since this post was opened but I kept on wondering about the Frankie cab I have and the remark you made about the presence of the 3" port holes. I have looked it over and there are NO port holes in the baffle. So how early in the Kustom world is this cab? Is this a rarity?

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Re: Ohms [message #21498 is a reply to message #21497]

Mon, 22 September 2014 23:35

pleat
Messages: 1452
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

I'd say sometime around 1965 or a little. Bud said the reason some frankie cabs didn't have port holes, is because he was cutting the baffle boards by hand and he broke his small hand saw that he used to cut the openings. He later had the broken saw mounted and hung in his office as a reminder to how it all got started.

pleat

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Re: Ohms [message #21499 is a reply to message #18858]

Tue, 23 September 2014 06:23

stevem
Messages: 4733
Registered: June 2004
Location: NY

Senior Member

Let clear something up here about checking the ohms of a cabinet that has a horn, or shirein in it with a ohm meter.

A ohm meter apply's a dC voltage to what it's checking and a DC voltage will not pass thru the horn's crossover cap to read the horn driver, so the end result is you are just gonna read the resistance of the speakers , but the Impedance will still be what that factory sheet calls for if all the drivers are stock and or the drivers have been replaced with matching impedance drivers and than also wired the same!

If you do not have a ohm meter to check your reloaded cabinet and to also save you the pain in the ass of backing out all those screws just get a telescoping mirror and a flash light , load the mirror thru one port and the shine the flash light thru the other and should be able to see how you wired the cabinet!
If you only used the stock wires I do not think you would have been able to wire it any other way but the needed parallel like it came from the factory!

I also like. Pleat posted do not understand why your 200 A head has only one speaker jack, is there a open hole right next to it?

[Updated on: Tue, 23 September 2014 06:34]

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Re: Ohms [message #21501 is a reply to message #21499]

Tue, 23 September 2014 12:45

pleat
Messages: 1452
Registered: June 2004
Location: Belding, Mi

Senior Member

The inspection mirror is a great idea for cabs that have the port tubes. Cabs with port holes behind the grill cloth, the old school way of removing all the screws and removal of the back is your only option.
I remove the back panels on all my cabs for a visual inspection of the brand of speakers, how the cab is really wired and the make sure the all the nuts are secure on each speaker. It also gives me the oppertunity to make sure the nuts that hold the baffle board to cabinet are still snug.
Plus you never can tell what you might find in the bottom of the cabinet that has port tubes. I bought a 3x15 siren cab once, that had about 8" of broken beer bottles in the bottom. Stale beer soaked the insulation and was a mess to clean up.

Since we've revived the old thread, you origianlly mentioned a single speaker output jack. A later post you said you found it Hiding behind the power cord was the #2 output output jack. If the jacks are between the cord wraps, it would be a K200A amp head.

If you found it by where the power cord goes into the back of the amp, you may have the older Frankie head and that amp would have or should still have the perferated hole back panel.

A lot of crazy things can happen over 45 years with an amplifier.
pleat

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Re: Ohms [message #21670 is a reply to message #18858]

Wed, 08 October 2014 14:05

Gavindale
Messages: 14
Registered: January 2010

Junior Member

I honestly believe that I do have the K 200 A-4 amplifier head. I believe this to be true due to the wonderful assistance and information supplied by this forum. I was just not being very observant when I originally posted that the head had only one output on the back. There are two, side by side, and on the other side of the back is the RCA out for line recording. The head in this discussion did not come with the gold sparkle cabs with the siren. These were two separate purchases. I purchased a "Kasino" PA that came with 2 gold sparkle cabs. Both cabs have 2-15" speakers and horns/sirens on the top. Their exteriors are different. One has the Kustom badge and is ported while the other is a "Frankie" cab without external or internal ports. I have never fired up the PA and the cabs yet. I might just try that out this weekend. I feel confident with ohm issues since the 3 pieces have been in use for years in a church. I just hope that I don't have any cap's ready to explode!. I do know that something went bad in my K 200 as it lost most of it's output and defiantly had issues pop up. I don't know how brave I will be in trying to trouble shoot the beast by myself. Time will tell! If you never see another post from me again then assume the worst and figure that there will be a Kustom Amplifier "non-working" on ebay listed by somebody other than me!
Stevem - the outputs on the back are as they should be and the 3-15" speaker cab is just that, 3 - 15" speakers that I wired together after having them reconed. No siren or crossover.

Thank you everyone!

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